Where in the lane...

[geechie]

...do you ride and why?

When I rode bicycles for fun and suffering, I was forced by the law to ride "...as far to the right as practicable." Holy crap!! You're freakin' invisible over there.

When I got back on to a motorcycle, I immediately moved to the left of the lane. (Or for the sake of you Brits, near the centerline and away from the verge.) Seems to me that you're much more visible to people coming onto the road from side streets and/or driveways. Plus the oncoming traffic notices you better as well.

But it seems that my view of the situation isn't universal. The other morning coming into work, I found myself behind a Charleston city officer on a Harley cop bike. I followed him for a couple of miles before he turned off. He hugged the shoulder of the road the whole way. WTF?

When I took the MSF ERC a couple of years ago, my 'instructors' were noncommittal at best on the subject. And, thinking back, the course materials had not much to say on the subject either.

So what do you guys think?

George

[Promethean]

I usually ride on the right third section of the lane that I'm in. I don't remember why I started doing that though. I'm not sure if that's good or bad.

-Abhijeet

[Optimus Prime]

On two lane roads I stick towards the centerline and move right when oncoming traffic is big (semi's, etc.) I also tend to "weave" instead of staying in one spot. I find the movement in the lane ups my visibility.

When riding on roads with more than one lane in each direction I will actively alternate between extremes. Extreme left/Right allows me to see past the cars in front of me, and gives me quick escape routes to the shoulder. Riding the centerline dividing same direction lanes keeps traffic in the other lane from getting next to me and boxing me in while also giving me the movement visibility I seek.

[Dallara]

Lane position... Ah, yes... Another one of those subjects where there are as many answers as there are questions, and there has never been a definitive consensus on what is *right* and if anything is *wrong*...

Here are my brief personal opions on the subject, George.

1.) Stay out of the middle of your lane, period. That's where all the oil, transmission fluid, coolant, etc. from all those cars and trucks gets collected and concentrated. This is even more important the closer you get to intersections. Stay where all the rubber gets put down because ruuber-to-rubber has more traction than just about anything else, just like the "blue groove" on a race track.

2.) I stay to the left (or nearest the centerline) of any lane I am in unless there is a necessary and apparent reason not to... i.e. chug holes, broken pavement, gravel, obvious spill, etc. Why? A bunch of reasons... A.) it gives you the most road on either side of you, and hence, more time and more pavement to use up in an emergency situation. B.) it is usually where the crown of the road is highest and so if there is moisture there should be less of it on the highest part of the roadway, and if moisture is washing any oil, dust, etc. away it is most likely washing it downhill. C.) It allows you to see the furthest around right-handers (in the USA, anyway) while still offering you the roughly the same field of view around left-handers. D.) All the reasons you mentioned, George/Geechie.

3.) The only true, hard and fast exception to #2 is when you are riding in a group. For that I prefer standard, split, staggered, two-by-two formation, where one rider is in one half of the lane a few bike lengths ahead and another one following is also in the opposite side of the lane a few bike lengths behind. This is the only time I ever try to ride in the curb-side of a lane - though still never in the middle of a lane.

That pretty much sums it up for me, but YMMV...

Cheers!

Allan (Dallara)

[GPM]

I generally ride as Allan has described. However, I have a few additions to number 2.

I will move to the right of the lane approaching left handers if it will afford me a significantly better view (cliff faces, trees close to the road, etc.). I also will move to the right of the lane overtaking traffic on the freeway. I do this to increase the amount of time I am visible in their side mirror, decrease blind spot, and create a bit of side to side movement. Just prior to reaching their bumper I will drift left and accelerate to increase buffer zone and reduce exposure.

I sometimes also move around the lane approaching intersections. If someone is sitting in the oncomming left turn lane I hope the movement will make me more noticible. I also will drift to the right just before hitting the intersection to increase space in case they move.

Generally speaking, left tire track of the lane, with a bunch of exceptions.

[BobFV1]

When I took the MSF ERC a couple of years ago, my 'instructors' were noncommittal at best on the subject. And, thinking back, the course materials had not much to say on the subject either.

Hey George -

I'm one of those MSF instructors - and you are right, we are pretty noncommittal about that. There are some "hints" in the current BRC book about lane position - one illustration shows how you should divide the lane up in to three sections but it doesn't say when you should select a particular section. Another couple of illustrations talk about "no-zones" around trucks on the highway, and the concept of a "space cushion".

I think that where the MSF really wants you to go is to adopt the SEE strategy and apply it. One of the sections I am teaching Thursday night includes interactive scenarios on a DVD and we really emphasize a "Search, Evaluate, Execute" strategy - part of the evaluation is lane position. (Disclaimer - that is my opinion, nothing I say is the official position of the MSF, blah blah blah...)

Jeff Dean (http://bmwdean.home.att.net/index.html), who was one of the Chief Instructors I worked with during RiderCoach training, is big on avoiding a doctrinaire adherence to any particular lane position (like always selecting the left wheel track - which is not always the best position, especially on the highway), but selecting one which is apropriate for the conditions. Again, several principals include sight lines (Keith Code is a good resource for this) and "see and be seen" with respect to being visible in the rear view mirrors of other vehicles.

If I had to pick the main principals in selecting lane position it would be to maintain the best "space cusion" possible with regard to other traffic, and to be in position to most safely see and be seen. And to remember that motorcycling is an inherently dangerous activity.

[geechie]

Excellent gentlemen. That pretty much confirms my feelings. Good to know there is a pretty fair degree of consensus among knowledgeable riders.

George

[Deans BMW]

I adhear to what Allan wrote, modifyied by what Bob wrote.

[DJ Down Under]

Here's what I do....ok imagine you're riding on the left side of the road...:)

Imagine the car wheel tracks...if it's on lane I ride in the right wheel track.

If it's two lanes and I'm in the left lane I ride in the right wheel track.

If I'm riding in the right lane I ride in the left wheel track.

If it's three lanes the left and right are the same as above and if I was in the middle lane I would ride in either left or right wheel tracks.

Comprehendo?..:D

DJ

[BobFV1]

Here's what I do....ok imagine you're riding on the left side of the road...:)

Imagine the car wheel tracks...if it's on lane I ride in the right wheel track.

If it's two lanes and I'm in the left lane I ride in the right wheel track.

If I'm riding in the right lane I ride in the left wheel track.

If it's three lanes the left and right are the same as above and if I was in the middle lane I would ride in either left or right wheel tracks.

Comprehendo?..:D

DJ

Godamnit DJ!!! - would you stop talking Australian and use some simple English we can all understand:confused:

At least if you say something incomprehensible, post a boobie picture to go with it!

[DJ Down Under]

How 'bout we have girls in high heel racing boots show us our correct position and lane we should be in...

and if we get it wrong..they spank us..and then we make up...and then more spanking..:D ...is that how it's done in the US..:p

Speaking of US..I love US girls..and now I know what the attraction is with wresling... http://70.85.193.165/quackpit//images/stories/videos/sexy/hotties_stripping.wmv

DJ

[socalrob]

I'm pretty much in tune with Dallara & Bob, however, there is one aspect I don't see mentioned much if at all.

I'm a land surveyor, so I actually walk out in traffic on a pretty wide variety of roads, & maybe see more road surface close up (like along the centerline on my hands & knees, looking for survey monuments or chiseling up things with traffic wizzin buy at 60mph, or like last Saturday in the rain, lying face down in a busy intersection reaching into a monument well 20 inches deep feeling around for a brass cap monument, just hoping to get done before I get run over). My point being, on busy roads any part of the pavement that is not cleaned of by wheels tends to collect all sorts of debris, nails & screws amoung it. For some reason, in almost every busy intersection I'll even find between 10 & 30 cents in coins, nice & beat by the cars, too. Wierdest thing I found was a dead cow that fell off a truck, but then that was pretty easy to spot. For instance, on intersections with turn lanes, there is an area in the centerline intersection of the roads where no vehicles ever travel (so much so that I consider it a safety zone), and all kinds of metal & rock stuff collects. IMHO, nails & screws are also going to be more common along street centerlines where cars rarely travel. So anytime you ride your bike on a part of the pavement that car wheels arn't generally on, I think you run a much higher risk of picking up nails & screws. Same would go for freeway ramps where you may have an urge to cut inside or outside a line of cars on what is technically the shoulder. Much higher chance of nails. Also, if you're making a left turn, don't go out into that very center part of the intersection where the debris lives.

I used to ride almost down lane stripes on freeways (when I had 2 empty lanes between cars) until I thought about the nail factor. Now I try to keep my tires in the traveled path. I have a feeling that the practice of lane sharing between the fast lane & the carpool double yellow is riding in nail heaven. I really suspect that some rider's complaints on how "unlucky" they are regarding picking up nails & screws has more to do with lane position than anyone thinks.

& just a plea for surveyors & road worker, please, please, do not ride up behind us & honk your horn. Its really scary. Almost as scary as hearing tires screeching behind you. :cool:

[arkline]

I ride a lot in an urban environment. I use the whole lane as conditions require. Many of the streets I ride on have heaves caused by tree roots going under the pavement. I try to find the lowest part of those.

There are any number of fascinating configurations for edge traps (concrete slabs laid next to one another with the groove ending up in either the right or left portion of the lane, troughs worn into the pavement where studded tires have eaten away at the pavement where normal car tracks would be, railroad tracks crossing the roadway at surprising angles, long foot wide corridors where the pavement has been resurfaced badly, stuff like that). I move side to side in my lane of choice to avoid these things.

I will sometimes move from side to side in a lane as I approach an intersection to give the oncoming traffic or people entering from the side a chance to see me better and recognize that I am moving.

I try to stay in the leftish portion of the lane when coming to a stop, so that the driver ahead of me gets a good squint at my headlight and I have a bit of skim if someone wants to crawl up my muffler from behind.

Given the maneuverability of two wheeled vehicles, I see no reason not to make use of the whole of the lane I'm in. There is no such thing as a perfect line in town anyway...:D

[Airman]

Arkline,

I tend to stay in the middle of the lane for several reasons. As mentioned before, it gives you room to move if someone intrudes on your space. Happens to me a lot. As well, I ride in the rain a lot, and the wallowed out wheel tracks collect a lot of water. Chances of hydroplaning are greater in the sides of the lane. On the interstate I have not found oil etc in the center, probably due to all the lane changing. I find the slick center at stoplights. Even there, where do your want the foot you put down, in the oil soaked center or the left and right dry spots ? I've never had a stopping problem in the center. (Must be the ABS) =)

Airman

[Bones]

I do pretty much what GPM said. But then, there are highways, too.

When on main highways, there are some things I am a bit obsessive about, regarding positioning. I am always extremely wary of being in anyone's blind spots. As a result, I tend to generally change my speed very frequently and tend to go above the posted speed limit after approaching a blind spot, if there is any traffic, so that I can spend as little time as possible in any blind spots. It also means a lot of lane changes. I get out of the right lane approaching the on ramps. Merging cars and trucks just don't see you. I spend more time than I like to think about paying attention to what is going on behind me, too.

I have been surprized as hell on occasion while going what I thought was at a pretty good clip, and been passed on the right by some bonehead in a cage at outrageous speed. So, I find the highway experience to be even more 360 degrees of attention than usual.

NOW, here is the important part for BobFV1:
Be very wary of areas with forks in the road or at "Y" intersections. They can be overrun with unexpected lubricants. These can distract you and draw you into behavior you might not other wise pursue. Bushes can obstruct your vision. Your traction becomes very important in those areas. All types of sensory input can be found in those areas and while pleasurable, you can really get into trouble, especially away from home. :omg:

Ride Safe!

Jeff

[socalrob]

Bones,

Your dead on about the perils of those 'Y' intersections. I've seen guys really pay the price when confronted with strange 'Y's, especially, like you say, when away from home.:embarassed:

[boxermania]

Ditto Allan's comments....with the exception of allowing for the wonderfull potholes and washboards that we enjoy in this neck of the woods Louisiana roads that is.......:thumbs_down:

[boxermania]

Wait a minute DJ....what was the thread about/.....Hell, at my age I don't remember half of the things I'm told and disregard the other half. Ahhhh, that's life.........

Now what were those girls doing in the ring????

[DJ Down Under]

Now what were those girls doing in the ring????
Geees I don't know..I might just have to watch it a few more times to find out....I'm sure it's an American thing..:)

What were we talking about..:D

DJ

[Wild Will]

require a different technique. All the roads I usually ride are narrow and follow a ridge that's as crooked as my ex's NYC cab driving brother. Around a right turn, you must stay to the right as far as is safe, in case some farmer's daughter has the Dodge out and is hell bent on using the whole 10-12 foot width with her dually pickup. She's moistly in the middle of the road. Sometimes you have to stop and close your eyes tight, wincing. I've seen riders in the middle of the lane get thrown off their bike by contact with a fat 4 wheeled machine.
On lefts I stay to the right as far as it's safe, because frequently the driver coming around the blind curve is in my half of the lane, and contact can throw you and the bike down as much as eight hundred feet, unless a hillside oak stops you. It's such a bitch getting the machinery back up to the road, having to wait for a pickup to drive by. Hope he has a rope. These adventures are usually accompanied by a broken rib or 2. There just aren't many straight roads on the N. coast, and the new crop of young drivers seem hell bent on straightening every curve to their advantage, making banzai runs at the unsuspecting rider following his dream line through the apex. Know what I mean? You know when you're in this terraign when the line disappears from the middle of the road, and it shrinks to a thought provoking width.

[jamming]

What Allan said, with a few deveations when I need to.
Rog

[DarthRider]

Pretty much what others have said, but...
A couple of things.

On a 2-lane highway or fast bi-way I'll usually be left of center (politically too, come to think of it!) but when meeting another vehicle I do a slow gentle swerve from the left track over to the right as the truck passes then continue the easy swerve back to left track. Three reasons: Lots of road scarf gets thrown/blown around by all vehicles like rocks, pebbles & sand which are always there to some degree, even on clean roads. This crap gets thrown up and out like a boat v-wake.
A scary amount of things fall off of or out of vehicles, especially trucks (especially fuckin' Mexican NAFTA trucks!) and it helps in staying ready to avoid those.

This happens very seldom, maybe 20 times in 48 years for me, but when stupid Bubba or airhead Misty throw their beer, coke, water cans & bottles out the window and accidentally or *intentionally* to try to smack an "unsuspecting" rider, instead they find a "suspecting" rider who is harder to hit. Bob & weave boys, bob & weave. Any subsequent retaliatory actions are up to you! I once got smacked right in the chops by a half-eaten cheeseburger at a closing speed of about 80...SONOFABITCH!

A subset of this is when some some high-school "hold my beer and watch this!) cretin swerves over into my lane, just trying to "have a little fun", I want to have all the maneuvering room possible. Little assholes should be boxed up and sent to Australia...they'd know what to do with them, we're just all puzzled and conflicted about it over here!

The most serious reason to deviate from all left - all the time is when approaching the old standard death-trap for riders...the intersection with an oncoming car stopped, ready to make a left turn across your lane.
If no one is ahead of me in my lane I stay left and flash my lights at him, expecting him to turn anyway. If he does, I am best positioned for any needed combination of left-right-slow-brake-accelerate maneuver(s). If he doesn't, I move right just before entering the intersection, expecting a last-second turn attempt.
But if someone is ahead of me in my lane I leave a longer than usual following interval and stay way-left, lights flashing to increase chances of being seen by the car ahead waiting to turn.
Then, assuming he doesn't see me or doesn't care and is going to turn anyway, at the last second I quickly accelerate to a shorter than usual interval behind the car ahead, moving to far-right at the same time. The left-turner can't see me at all then, but even if he tries a quick-turn behind the car ahead, he can't hit me if he tries.

Sometimes "visibility" is useful, sometimes a good "blocker" running interference for you is best. And in traffic situations like that, it's helpful to both cover the brakes and run 1-gear lower than if there were no traffic at all.
Expect the absolute worst behavior from others and be ready.

And like Ol' Dave says, "They can't hit you if you ain't there!"

Dave

[geechie]

And like Ol' Dave says, "They can't hit you if you ain't there!"

That 'ol Dave is a pretty clever peckerhead.

George

[DarthRider]

Well Geechie...I don't know about "clever" but you nailed the "Peckerhead" part!